Dave's System

Queue the Imperial March. DarthNater is in the house. Welcome to Heavy's Wrong Way Craps forum - where the discussions focus on the Dark Side of casino craps. You can bet our resident expert, DarthNater, has answers. If he doesn't, there are plenty of other Dark Siders who normally stand quietly down at the end of the table who will be more than willing to chime in. Not sure about making Don't Come Bets? Unsure about Lay Bets, and Laying Odds? Never heard of the One Hit - Can't Miss? Wouldn't know a Hybrid Play from a Zee-Donk? You've come to the right place. You'll find all that - plus Dark Side strategies for Dice Influencers - and MORE! Come on in.

Moderators: 220Inside, DarthNater

Bones
Posts: 233
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:36 am
Location: Mississippi

Re: Dave's System

Post by Bones » Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:26 am

There are $5 tables here. Would I be better off placing $5 dc then placing single odds?
Welcome to my World

The Trend Will End


Dark Side

Re: Dave's System

Post by Dark Side » Tue Mar 29, 2016 12:10 pm

$5Bill wrote:High Dark Side

I go by the average number of rolls per shooter which is 8.525510 per the Wizard of Odds. So I put my Don't Come bet out after the 8th roll.


$5Bill
Right, that is what prompted me to try it a long time back. I went to a 5 count because I was leaving to many wins on the table.

I used it this weekend with success when the tables were in transition.

Works very well.

House of Orange
Posts: 1328
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:09 am

Re: Dave's System

Post by House of Orange » Sun Apr 10, 2016 4:54 am

So what is the consensus? After an established point, wait 3, 5, or 8 rolls before the DC? I'm liking 3 with a 7 coming more than 50%, 4 rolls after point is set.

Dark Side

Re: Dave's System

Post by Dark Side » Sun Apr 10, 2016 12:00 pm

The table will tell you when to book your DC bet. Last night the tables I was playing, were going 7 out at the 6th or 7th roll. I waited until 5 rolls then booked the bet. Why put your money up and give a shooter 3 or 4 rolls to take it down?

User avatar
heavy
Site Admin
Posts: 10556
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 11:46 am
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: Dave's System

Post by heavy » Tue Jun 07, 2016 8:21 pm

Welcome out of lurkdom! Posters ALWAYS appreciated. That's what makes this thing worth doing.

To answer your question, it's the volatility. Dave's purpose in not laying the four and ten is avoiding it, thinking the 1 - 2 payoff is a tough one. Personally, I always lay the four and ten. But then, you're not playing Dave's System. LOL.
"Get in, get up, and get gone."
- Heavy

User avatar
London Shooter
Posts: 2590
Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 3:15 am

Re: Dave's System

Post by London Shooter » Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:35 pm

And that's why the casino wants to offer you 100x odds in some cases. They know we know it's the best bet in the house but they also want us to have as much volatility as possible.

$4000 buyin to win $200 seems simple enough but what if you lose your first two or three bets? Do you chase or do you have the discipline to grind it out or quit whilst you are behind?

The casino is happy to sit and wait, outgunning you with their bankroll, waiting for you to overbet and hit that bad run that busts your buyin.

bobbylee

Re: Dave's System

Post by bobbylee » Tue Jun 07, 2016 11:48 pm

As Heavy does, I never or rarely refuse a 4/10 lay .
Betting on others, I use a lay 4/10 for both defensive and offensive purposes depending on how far the hand has progressed and other conditions.
I never lay bets when I'm shooting PL
A Lay 5/9 is a short affair for me and I never, never lay a 6/8. Kudos for those who do and profit.
No lay bet odds do I leave very long - 1for 2 odds can become a long road to hoe.

Last year in Vegas, using a separate bankroll, I would Lay $200 on a randy when a propitious roll of the 4/10 happened. Conditions , were:
-the selected shooter a genuine randy
-after three or more tosses for the 4/10 to happen, lay it
-leave it up for only three tosses
-once each casino, with or without other play

Made $1,000 with no losses(less vig).
Make a profit most trips since then, but nothing like that initial 10 wins without a loss!

User avatar
heavy
Site Admin
Posts: 10556
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 11:46 am
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: Dave's System

Post by heavy » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:31 am

Well, I'll always lay every number, although the five and nine have spanked me many times. Typically I'll lay $30 per number regardless of what the number is. I make continuous DC bets with odds. I often get five to six numbers up without a repeater, which is fat city. If I get knocked off one number I'll usually stop making DC bets. If I get knocked off of two numbers I'll bump my odds up to $60 on any remaining bets. If I get knocked off a third bet then I'll take all of my lay odds remaining down and I'm done with that shooter, down $150 or so on the hand. Grind it back on the next couple of shooters and hope you don't get two good shooters in a row.
"Get in, get up, and get gone."
- Heavy

Moe Bettor
Posts: 1596
Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:31 pm

Re: Dave's System

Post by Moe Bettor » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:41 am

Using WinCraps post a video of Dave's system at work. I would like to see that.

User avatar
KrapsNovice
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2016 5:53 pm

Re: Dave's System

Post by KrapsNovice » Sun Sep 18, 2016 10:26 pm

I played the "Dave" about a dozen times. Unfortunately, I lost 1,200.00 twice while playing it at 40% of his original play (he would lose 3k). Once your in the hole and the tables are choppy or hot it is a miserable experience. I would switch tables after being clobbered and my new table would turn hot or choppy in an instant.

Not sure if Dave or anyone is still playing this. After reading this thread many times I was excited to play this method. I wish I had stopped after my first loss I figured Dave lost once every 100 times I cannot lose once more but I did. Bottom line this is gambling and anything can happen. I had extra money after selling my old truck on craigslist. Now I wish I never listed it.

flextimeLV
Posts: 282
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 6:25 am

Re: Dave's System

Post by flextimeLV » Mon Sep 19, 2016 12:52 am

Describe for us the "Dave" method you employed? Let's make sure you played true to his system. Sorry about the losses.

User avatar
KrapsNovice
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2016 5:53 pm

Re: Dave's System

Post by KrapsNovice » Mon Sep 19, 2016 6:22 pm

flextimeLV wrote:Describe for us the "Dave" method you employed? Let's make sure you played true to his system. Sorry about the losses.
I played it as posted by 2fist and later clarified by nickelmidnight. I have read this thread many times played it online many hours before put real money in play.

I even qualified tables the last couple of times that I used the "Dave" per 2fists instructions. Meaning he would have profited on the last two players and then jumps in.

I will give an example:

5$ DP

Point is 4.

5$ DC

Travels to the 6 so I lay 24$

Another 5$ DC

Travels to the 9 so I lay 30$

Another 5$ DC

Travels to the 9 I lose one lay so I lay another 30.

Another 5$ DC

Travels to the 8 so I lay 24$.

Another 5$ DC

Travels to the 6 I lost my second lay. I take down all remaining lays leave the flats and wait for a new player.

After losing 400.00 I would up my lays to 75/60 for the remaining 800.

flextimeLV
Posts: 282
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 6:25 am

Re: Dave's System

Post by flextimeLV » Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:25 pm

So a few hot shooters hammered you in both sessions. Hate when the dice zig when you zag and zag when you zig as if some power in the cosmos refuses to let you win in order to teach you a big picture lesson relevant to your life situation. Did you list the truck mostly to generate extra cash to give 'the Dave' a go?

Dark Side

Re: Dave's System

Post by Dark Side » Tue Sep 20, 2016 11:15 am

KrapsNovice

If I remember correctly, Dave played when the casino tables opened, every day, seems to be when they are the coldest. He never starts a session mid day or evening.

Are you playing your sessions, first thing in the AM?

DS

wild child
Posts: 1522
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:29 pm

Re: Dave's System

Post by wild child » Tue Sep 20, 2016 12:00 pm

Dark Side wrote:KrapsNovice

If I remember correctly, Dave played when the casino tables opened, every day, seems to be when they are the coldest. He never starts a session mid day or evening.

Are you playing your sessions, first thing in the AM?

DS
>
Do you find differing results on those tables that never open before around 12 Noon
and those in joints
that seemingly have at least one craps table to stay open 24hrs 7 days 365 per year :?:

<
w c

Dark Side

Re: Dave's System

Post by Dark Side » Tue Sep 20, 2016 12:32 pm

wild child wrote:
Do you find differing results on those tables that never open before around 12 Noon
and those in joints
that seemingly have at least one craps table to stay open 24hrs 7 days 365 per year :?:

<
w c
In the Pacific Northwest, the tables at tribal casinos open between 1000 and noon. More often than not they run on the cold side for a short period of time, then change to chop. After that, your guess is as good as mine how they are going to act.

I can't give a fair comparison versus the 24 hour table or tables, because we don't have them. All I know is, I prefer to be at the table of choice when it opens. I want to add, this goes with any table at any time during the day or night. We have tables opening at varying times, they all seem to be inclined to play cold.

DS

User avatar
KrapsNovice
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2016 5:53 pm

Re: Dave's System

Post by KrapsNovice » Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:41 pm

flextimeLV wrote:So a few hot shooters hammered you in both sessions. Hate when the dice zig when you zag and zag when you zig as if some power in the cosmos refuses to let you win in order to teach you a big picture lesson relevant to your life situation. Did you list the truck mostly to generate extra cash to give 'the Dave' a go?
I have read this thread so many times and hoped to get together a few thousand to try it out. I would always have an unexpected bill or two that kept me from trying it out. Of course when I sold my old truck I thought it is now or never, thinking worse case I would lose once.

User avatar
KrapsNovice
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2016 5:53 pm

Re: Dave's System

Post by KrapsNovice » Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:50 pm

Dark Side wrote:KrapsNovice

If I remember correctly, Dave played when the casino tables opened, every day, seems to be when they are the coldest. He never starts a session mid day or evening.

Are you playing your sessions, first thing in the AM?

DS
I played it late in the evening (weekdays) after work usually after 8pm.
The last time that I lost I left the casino at 2am it was a long drive home. My stomach felt ill as I drove home I could not believe I lost twice. I hardly slept and had a hard time functioning @ work.

Dark Side

Re: Dave's System

Post by Dark Side » Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:13 am

I suggest you go back to the basics. Dave's System works for Dave because he's willing to keep going to his wallet until he gets his walk away money.

It appears you are playing above your bankroll or, it's not a system that's comfortable for you and need to leave it alone.

DS

User avatar
KrapsNovice
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2016 5:53 pm

Re: Dave's System

Post by KrapsNovice » Wed Sep 21, 2016 6:02 pm

Dark Side wrote:I suggest you go back to the basics. Dave's System works for Dave because he's willing to keep going to his wallet until he gets his walk away money.

It appears you are playing above your bankroll or, it's not a system that's comfortable for you and need to leave it alone.

DS
Actually, Dave is willing to lose 3k to get his "walk away money". I did it at 40% which comes out to 1,200.00. His "walk away money" would be 200.00 mine would be 80.00. I took it to the max losing 1200 twice, so I kept going into my wallet. So "basics" whatever you mean by that is irrelevant. I lost twice within a span of a few days trying to make 80.00.

About my bankroll perhaps. If I ever tried the "Dave" again I would make sure to have at least 5 x's my daily loss limit. That would be 6k. As things are that would be in the very distant future and I doubt I would try it out again. One needs to have hours to play this game to make a comeback or lose their max loss. Like many others I have obligations and not knowing when I have to spend 6 -10 hours attempting a comeback is impossible. I made the 80.00 within minutes a few times, grinded back after a few hours of play once and lost it all in 6 hours and 7 hours.

For anyone that is risk averse, retired with plenty of available time, it might be worthwhile
Last edited by KrapsNovice on Thu Sep 22, 2016 2:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

Post Reply