Can a poor srr still bring profit?

[Craps75]

Sometimes the crap between my ears gets so hard, I need a swift kick!! Heavy, MP, and others have been posting over and over about the importance of discipline and a good betting method. MP, over and over has been saying, that good shooters could make more money if they bet properly. What about poor shooters??

My shooting has totally went down the drain pipe. I can't seem to get anything to go right. I don't have a large gambling budget and usually buy in somewhere between $150 and $300. Normally on the $150 side. I have been taking $150 in chips and betting like I would at the casino when I log my rolls. Just like I have been doing in the casino, night after night, I am losing my backside. Good thing about playing at home is, it doesn't affect your wallet.

I normally log all my rolls into bone tracker and analyze every detail. SRR, BSR, on axis %, and what different set I could use to get a better result. While doing that I have been overlooking one MAJOR part of bone tracker. The bet summary tool.

Now I know that I have got to work on my shooting. I know that I have got to improve in that avenue, but I am just now realizing my betting is killing me!! With my meager bankroll I don't feel comfortable placing enough money to do a profitable regression. I normally start with a $6 6 and 8 and press from there. The problem with that is it takes a long roll to make any kind of a decent profit. Most of us are not going to have enough long rolls to ever make that profitable. Again exactly what MP has been saying over and over again.

My current srr is 5.69 (yes I am ashamed to even post that) and my current BSR is 3.86. I doubt that there is anyone reading this forum with numbers much lower than that. Would you believe me if I told you that even with those numbers I've made a profit??

Back to the tool that I have overlooked for way to long in bone tracker. The bet summary tool. It's very straight forward and easy to use. I have it set up to make a $5 passline with single odds, $12 6 and 8, and a $5 5 and 9. It never presses the bet amount or randomly makes a "crazy crapper" bet. If you place a horn or a yo it applies it to every roll. Also every number is placed for the amount you specify even if it is the point number. So if you place a 6 and hit the point you will get paid for your $5 odds as well as a $12 place bet.

With those horrible numbers I am currently $199 ahead!! That's with no pressing. I know on a long roll that pressing can really help you pick up you winnings. It's killer on the short rolls though because so many times we leave money on the table that should be in our rack. For the last few rolls I betted this way. No pressing and no prop bets. I am currently up without any long rolls at all. I may not be influencing the dice much but they are consistently hitting those inside numbers. I believe if I will flat bet like I have been doing I can grind out a win.

I'm going to try this live later this month. I now realize that my start small press big strategy just isn't going to cut it. After I am up and everything on the lay out is paid for I will probably press some. I no that there isn't a strategy or betting plan that can take away the house edge. If we can minimize the house edge and place just a little influence then we can come out a winner.

[Craps75]

Thing is everytime I go dark side I hit a long roll!! I tried going dark side and made 3 points and took out three don't comes lol. While not a huge profit I did put things in the plus just flat betting. Everytime I press a bet the seven shows the very next roll. I'm hitting numbers in twos though so I'm making a lot of points and hitting a lot of sevens on the comeout.

[wild child]

C 75........May I suggest just step back...read all that Heavy M P and the stalwarts have to say

There are a number of methods to protect your Buy In as well as your Bank Roll

Learn the Initial Steep Regression move....The dice tossing thing takes time including PRACTICE

A cool way to "PRACTICE while under THE GUN " is to establish equal $ Pass Line and Don;t Pass Line
wagers on the same Come Out roll and just shoot until there is a decision....ZERO LOSS once past
the Come Out and no other bets are wagered...........Watch the results of your toss as you may see
a lot to critique ....bounce, hop off table..skitter side ways stop cold upon impact with the table surface etc,etc,etc............Make notes and when at home on your table or practice rig....work out
the wrinkles......that is the "TAKES TIME THINGY" few folks wish to deal with.........

Once you are able to identify a SKILLED TOSS from a randomly flung pitch,you will start to identify
the D I toss from the OTHER GUYS......

There is profit to be made making Do Not Side WAGERS........King of that hill is Dylanfreake

Read his old posts and other Dark Side winning methodologies ......

Check recommended books in Heavy's BOOKS THREAD

Heavy has a program soon in Tunica I know the training as outlined for that weekend
is available in no other place in such a modest time frame and TUITION....Stuff you can place into
play pronto...........The resulting knowledge could repay over and over often and deep into
the future..........

Just me saying

PS : Welcome to the board

[Dave73]

Im new to DI so take this with a grain of salt...

I had a 720 roll session with a SRR of 4.86
I had another 500ish log around 5.3
Playing with bonetracker I found that had I used the all 7 set my SRR would have been 6.89. Something was wrong. I knew BT would track primary, single pitch, etc, but to me it was too little too late. I turned to a teaching method I have used while helping friends ride motorcycles on the track... Who knew there would be a correlation there?

The simple method I used on the bikes was to video the guys from behind, then during the rest periods between sessions we would review the footage. This LIVE feedback allowed them to make corrections the very next session ( as opposed to viewing the video the next day and trying to apply it weeks or months later)

So I started to change the way I logged my rolls. I made a simple chart with 7 columns titled: PRIMARY, SINGLE PITCH, DOUBLE PITCH, BOTH AXIS (off), LEFT AXIS, RIGHT AXIS, AND BAD TOSS

Using the hardway set its fast and easy to see where each roll would be logged ( with a tick mark, not the actual roll). A six or one showing was off axis for that particular die, a hardway is a primary hit, a 3-4 or 5-2 seven is a double pitch, and anything else was a single pitch. The BAD TOSS was subjective but alll of the bad tosses got logged as well.

I would have four sets of dice set and ready to toss. Make the tosses, mark the log. I could then determine instantly how the mechanics of the toss effected the outcome and make adjustments for the next four tosses. I have only done this a few times but it seems to be working as I notice myself checking the single pitch more and the double pitch less through the sessions.

FWIW, using the HW set ~80% of my sevens come from double pitching

[falcon]

When and where I play it is almost always random 98% of the time so SRR's are not in play if one is counting. With a $300 buy in on a $10 table, one can play a long time and make a profit most of the time, if you are willing to be patient, disciplined, and bored.

The Play:
$10 each doey/don't
Point 6 or 8
$10 FO on the point and $30 Don't Odds + $10 each on the 5 & 6 (8 is the point). Forget the odds on the 6 until it hits then add the $2 if the casino will allow it. One hit and 7 out and you are up. An immediate point conversion and you are down $18; an immediate 7 out and you are down $5. The good news about this strategy is that if the hits come you are winning and the 7 out does not hurt. Other numbers rolled are mute--no harm, no foul.

Point is 5/9:
Same doey/don't and same FO bet on point and same $30 Don't odds with $10 each 6 & 8

Point is 4/10: same thing

If the table is cold or choppy, with the points 4,5,9 or 10 you may wish to just play $30 Don't odds and Place three other numbers like the 5,6, & 8. The point conversion can hurt but it is not unrecoverable with a loss of $30. Also you could add a $2 C & E which gives you six more ways to win even though a hit elsewhere nets $2 less.

You may want to practice this on a computer game like the Wizard or some other available entity like Win Craps.

falcon

[wudged]

Why would you take and lay odds on a doey/don't at the same time?

On 6/8, taking 10 odds and laying 30 will net either -18 (12-30) on a pass or +15 (25-10) on a miss. Why not just lay 18 (0-18 on a pass, 15-0 on a miss) for the same effect?

Likewise lay $15 on 5/9 and $10 on 4/10.

[Craps75]

5.69 SSR no more!!!! What a session I had tonight. If only I could duplicate these results in casino. I have brought my SSR up to 6.71 with a BSR of 4.76. I had a 39 roll hand and then a 42 roll hand a couple of rolls later. Here are the numbers.

10,5,6,9,5,9,3,2,12,10HP,7,6,2,11,8,9,9,4H,8,12,5,5,10,9,6P,8H,5,4H,4,9,3,6H,4,8P,4,5,8,8H,7Out
9,5,7out
4H,9,4P,9,7Out
9,3,8,5,3,11,2,2,3,9P,6,6P,12,6,9,5,9,4,8,3,6P,4,9,8,4P,8,8HP,8H,8P,8H,8HP,7,7,2,9,5,8,8,5,9P,8,7Out


I'd love to see how you come out on these rolls with your $204 across MP. Also look how Heavy's "see a horn bet a horn" would have done. At one point 5 horn numbers back to back. My on axis % is still off but my throw felt better tonight and I did bring my on axis % up.

This brings me to another question. How much does your SRR change during a book of rolls? Mine was actually down in the 3's at one point. Now I've got it back up with a couple of decent throws. Is that showing any influence at all, in your opinion, or did I just hit a good "lucky" streak? BTW most of the sevens I have throwed in this book have been back to back. A don't player would have actually got cleaned out even when my SRR was in the 5's.

I would also like to ask, are the repeat numbers in this series of numbers normal? I have always felt like I repeated several numbers. Never hit the 8 six times back to back though!!

Anyway feels good to climb back up the mountain some!!

[Mad Professor]

I had a 39 roll hand and then a 42 roll hand a couple of rolls later. Here are the numbers.

10,5,6,9,5,9,3,2,12,10HP,7,6,2,11,8,9,9,4H, 8,12,5,5,10,9,6P,8H,5,4H,4,9,3,6H,4,8P,4, 5,8,8H,7Out

9,5,7out

4H,9,4P,9,7Out

9,3,8,5,3,11,2,2,3,9P,6,6P,12,6,9,5,9,4,8, 3,6P,4,9,8,4P,8,8HP,8H,8P,8H,8HP,7,7,2, 9,5,8, 8,5,9P,8,7Out

I'd love to see how you come out on these rolls with your $204 across MP.

Hi Craps75,

As requested, I ran your four most recent hands against the MP $204-Across Regression. Here’s how they fared:

10,5,6,9,5,9,3,2,12,10HP,7,6,2,11,8,9,9,4H,8, 12,5,5,10,9,6P,8H,5,4H,4,9,3,6H,4,8P, 4,5,8,8H,7Out…+$405

9,5,7out…-$155

4H,9,4P,9,7Out…+$63

9,3,8,5,3,11,2,2,3,9P,6,6P,12,6,9,5,9, 4,8,3,6P,4,9, 8,4P,8,8HP,8H,8P,8H,8HP, 7,7,2,9,5,8,8,5,9P,8,7Out…+$500

Craps75, the net-win from these four hands of yours would be +$813.

As you know, I don’t work the MP-$204 on the come-out because on unknown-to-me DI’s, I don’t know what their individual come-out intentions are. With many skilled-shooter’s going for instant-wins (Horns, World/Whirl, etc.) during the C-O cycle; I find it best not to second-guess their intent.

Thanks for sharing your rolls.


MP

[Craps75]

MP,

Thanks for running those rolls. That turned out a nice profit. With my very conservative betting I only turned out a $300 profit on those rolls. I had another session again last night and rolled into the 20's. I don't remember the exact number. After the first hit I pressed each number one unit. I made a $300 profit on that one roll. Of course this is all in practice at home but it is encouraging to have a decent roll.